tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post9162537094863364083..comments2024-02-28T18:29:41.120-08:00Comments on Not of General Interest: Was there ever a time of idealism in college?undinehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05589384016564587214noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-56559168148119376622014-09-22T16:42:28.009-07:002014-09-22T16:42:28.009-07:00Bardiac--agreed. A woman hitchhiking would have a...Bardiac--agreed. A woman hitchhiking would have an entirely more dangerous experience. If you read Carolyn Cassady's or Joyce Johnson's memoirs, you find that they're too busy making a living to support the "free" lifestyle of Kerouac and Cassady to travel much, anyway. undinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05589384016564587214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-15458945152962401892014-09-21T18:38:08.402-07:002014-09-21T18:38:08.402-07:00I agree that it's really a class issue. I thi...I agree that it's really a class issue. I think there are some gender issues, too. Going to college in the late 70s, I was told by my mother that it didn't much matter what I studied because I could always go to secretarial school and work as a secretary until I got married, if need be. My brother got much more professionalizing advice and opportunities from our middle-class family situation.<br /><br />(I'd also add that gender mattered in Kerouac's situation, too. He didn't face the same risks that women did on the road, I don't think.)Bardiachttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11846065504793800266noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-71479130877648278242014-09-21T07:19:40.025-07:002014-09-21T07:19:40.025-07:00z--This is interesting. It sounds as though your p...z--This is interesting. It sounds as though your parents were giving you the standard line of privilege (do what you want, don't try too hard since that's vulgar, be bohemian but know that there's a bailout point), but your ideas sound like a much better life philosophy. <br /><br />The academics--well, that's another story. They don't have any power over you except their opinions, and what are those worth? Pretty much zip. An essay I always loved is called "Why Paul Fussell thinks he's better than you," because it demolishes the whole "of course, academics really know the best way to live, and if you don't want to adopt these values, you're less than the dust." Academic opinions are like something I heard in a movie once: "Your ideas aren't better--just louder." undinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05589384016564587214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-71159868232858045902014-09-20T22:12:40.203-07:002014-09-20T22:12:40.203-07:00p.s. It is a very interesting post. I am going to ...p.s. It is a very interesting post. I am going to have to analyze the double discourse of my parents' depression raised and not entirely feminist discourse.<br /><br />On the one hand: just enjoy life, do not try too hard, do what you like. On the other: if you try anything challenging like a career, the point will be to survive, not to excel, because you will not be good enough or that.<br /><br />Let me think of the ingredients. One: the idea that failure is probable and all is lost. Two: the idea that one is entitled and should jut enjoy. Three: the idea that one should be a bohemian and reject bourgeois life. Four: the idea that bourgeois life is just a phone call away.<br /><br />They were born in the 20s. I was born in the 50s and people keep saying people my age are the follow-your-blissers but I think they are mistaken -- it was what we were told, but not something we thought we could do. My parents had four ideas but I had two: One: you should try to attain bourgeois standards of living, because if not life will be difficult; such attainment is difficult but possible. Two: you can excel and enjoy it; having an interesting life through work is possible; it is not a question of awful work divided from fun play.<br /><br />What do you think of my generational analysis here, is it typical or not?Zhttp://profacero.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-28032463622144740972014-09-20T21:36:08.447-07:002014-09-20T21:36:08.447-07:00Yes, although I don't think I was told it with...Yes, although I don't think I was told it with sincerity. I think the thinking was that to study something useful would make one less valuable on the marriage market: you wanted the aristocratic stamp, so you would not just have to marry someone vulgarly "in trade" (i.e. business, medicine, engineering, law). <br /><br />That was one layer. Another was, my parents imagined I would be a bohemian, and it was obvious that this would not be possible as it might have been at midcentury. A third was that it did not matter at all: I would be a suburban housewife so the best thing to study would be humanities and arts, because with that I would amuse myself on the long, lonely suburban days.<br /><br />When I was going to quit academia and do something useful (although more idealistic -- it was a certain kind of law), academics *really* hit the roof, though. Everything except academic work in humanities was a crass search for shiny objects, they said.Zhttp://profacero.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-63411329904386885992014-09-19T19:28:40.691-07:002014-09-19T19:28:40.691-07:00nicoleandmaggie--That's what I thought. It see...nicoleandmaggie--That's what I thought. It seems, and seemed, so obvious that "follow your bliss" relies on a safety net (like plentiful jobs or financially secure parents who would support you). <br /><br />Flavia--You're right about the professionalization of the arts and how access to that kind of life is more restricted now. It gets back to that issue of jobs, too: for Kerouac and the mid-century people, jobs were plentiful and always there and could, in a pinch, support you. With the degradation of wages, that's not the case today. undinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05589384016564587214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-48312897952965994342014-09-18T11:31:09.559-07:002014-09-18T11:31:09.559-07:00I completely agree with you, and with nicoleandmag...I completely agree with you, and with nicoleandmaggie--it's a class issue, but it's been complicated by income inequality. It did use to be easier to live a bohemian life on little money, and the artistic life was more open to people from the middle and lower classes both for that reason and because many of the arts were less professionalized (professionalization itself being an effect of rising income inequality): you didn't have to get an MFA or MA or even a college degree to be a writer or painter or musician or actor, and you didn't have to have parents or professors with connections; you just moved to some scummy LES apartment, met a few people, and became part of the scene. <br /><br />That obviously didn't guarantee any kind of success, and no one could live that way forever--but many more people could at least imagine pursuing an artistic life.Flaviahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17832765671541392835noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-22001031.post-31725115611099970912014-09-18T09:04:54.969-07:002014-09-18T09:04:54.969-07:00Yes, definitely a class issue. Of course, widenin...Yes, definitely a class issue. Of course, widening economic inequality (both with and without the recession) has put more people in the situation where following dreams isn't as important as job security and food. So exactly what you say, the shrinking middle class can no longer advise their kids to "follow your bliss."<br /><br />We've got some old posts on that topic in our blog somewhere.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com